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"‘Tonight, in the city of David, a Savior is born, 'tis Christ the Lord.'"

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-Bishop Fulton J. Sheen
Placating terrorists, meeting with dictators, compassion for murderers... but no humanity for the unborn... incredible.
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nattyjk Profile
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Registered: 09-2005
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Many paths to God


So my inlaws are in town staying with us and that can make for some "interesting" discussions. The other night it was politics, tonight we touched on religion. (Two things we should really probably not discuss when they are here! emoticon ) I missed the first part of tonight's debate as I was on the phone with my grandma, but I was curious what the buzz was about and stuck my nose in after I hung up.

I guess the other day my oldest son, Joey, who is 10, made a comment in the presence of my mother-in-law (henceforth MIL) and step-father-in-law (henceforth SFIL) that inspired the discussion. My MIL said that Joey said there is one religion. This apparently bothered them. Of course, we know there are many religions, but I'm sure that's not what he was talking about. So my SFIL was telling me that you cannot tell someone that their beliefs are not true because then you are putting limits on God's power. We cannot judge that what they believe is not true because then we are setting ourselves up as God. I guess the ultimate gist of their assertions is the many paths to God philosophy. At least, that's what I got out of it.

So, being a concerned mother, I asked whether they had told my son the things they were telling me. SFIL said, "Oh, no, he wouldn't understand all that anyway." (Well thank the True God for that. emoticon ) Then MIL said, "Well, no matter how old a child is, he shouldn't be taught that there is only one religion and other people are wrong."

They are Christians, by the way (non-Catholic). Of course, we know this idea is not without its proponents in Catholicism as well.

Oy.

Last edited by nattyjk, Apr/28/2009, 12:23 am


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Michael D Profile
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Registered: 09-2005
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Re: Many paths to God


Since MIL and SFIL are protestant I assume they mean that there is one Christ and many churches. Or do they mean the Christ is not the Way, the Truth, and the Light?

---
Nothing by force, but everything by charity.

Ss. Thomas Aquinas and Augustine, pray for us.
Apr/28/2009, 10:23 am Link to this post Send Email to Michael D   Send PM to Michael D
 
nattyjk Profile
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Re: Many paths to God


The context of the discussion included all religions, as far as I understood. Buddhism, Islam, whatever....you can't tell someone that what they believe is false.

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AdMajoremDeiGloriam Profile
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Registered: 08-2005
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Re: Many paths to God


"you can't tell someone that what they believe is false."

You have pretty messed-up relatives . Then again , I am not surprised at all - it's the land of the homemade messiah after all ( crown of thorns plus designer clothing included ) - I only wonder if USA is worthy to be spared the coming abomination of desolation .
Apr/28/2009, 2:14 pm Link to this post Send Email to AdMajoremDeiGloriam   Send PM to AdMajoremDeiGloriam
 
nattyjk Profile
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Re: Many paths to God


You know, this has preoccupied my mind since last night and today something occurred to me....Whatever other problems this idea clearly has, isn't it also a hypocritical and ironic one? By telling me I can't believe that we should (and, in fact, are obligated to) denounce false teachings, he is telling me that I have a false belief, the very thing he is saying we cannot to do. emoticon

Last edited by nattyjk, Apr/28/2009, 2:20 pm


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nattyjk Profile
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Re: Many paths to God


quote:

I only wonder if USA is worthy to be spared the coming abomination of desolation.


It's not lookin' too good for the home team. emoticon

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Michael D Profile
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Re: Many paths to God


Pontius Pilate asked, "What is truth?" It seems that most people are comfortable being relativists. I guess thinking that there is no single truth is less frightening than facing the implications of their being only one truth and getting it wrong.

As for other religions, we can hope that God is merciful to those who are truly deluded and gives them their opportunity to choose the truth but thinking one is good as another? I don't get it. I look around and see what a mess we have made of this country and if you husband's parents are this confused it has been going on for quite a while. I don't know how much of God's mercy we can count on.

---
Nothing by force, but everything by charity.

Ss. Thomas Aquinas and Augustine, pray for us.
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SHJIHM Profile
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Registered: 07-2005
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Re: Many paths to God


quote:

We cannot judge that what they believe is not true because then we are setting ourselves up as God.



This stuck out at me.

Jesus sent forth his Apostles to preach to various towns. And if they would not listen, He instructed them to shake the dust off their feet.

Obviously, the Apostles preached the one True faith. Now for those who refused to listen, Jesus says:

And whosoever shall not receive you, nor hear you, when ye depart thence, shake off the dust under your feet for a testimony against them. Verily I say unto you, It shall be more tolerable for Sodom and Gomorrha in the day of judgment, than for that city.

The Apostles did not all preach something different. They all did not accept anything other than the True faith they preached.

We can most certainly judge others in the faith they reject in Jesus by choosing a non-Catholic faith. For it is not the same as judging their souls.



---
"My Sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow Me.


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Michael D Profile
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Re: Many paths to God


For this was I born, and for this came I into the world; that I should give testimony to the truth. Every one that is of the truth, heareth my voice.

---
Nothing by force, but everything by charity.

Ss. Thomas Aquinas and Augustine, pray for us.
Apr/28/2009, 5:12 pm Link to this post Send Email to Michael D   Send PM to Michael D
 
nattyjk Profile
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Re: Many paths to God


Romans 1: 16-25

For I am not ashamed of the gospel. For it is the power of God unto salvation to every one that believeth, to the Jew first, and to the Greek. For the justice of God is revealed therein, from faith unto faith, as it is written: The just man liveth by faith. For the wrath of God is revealed from heaven against all ungodliness and injustice of those men that detain the truth of God in injustice: Because that which is known of God is manifest in them. For God hath manifested it unto them. For the invisible things of him, from the creation of the world, are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made; his eternal power also, and divinity: so that they are inexcusable.

Because that, when they knew God, they have not glorified him as God, or given thanks; but became vain in their thoughts, and their foolish heart was darkened. For professing themselves to be wise, they became fools. And they changed the glory of the incorruptible God into the likeness of the image of a corruptible man, and of birds, and of fourfooted beasts, and of creeping things. Wherefore God gave them up to the desires of their heart, unto uncleanness, to dishonour their own bodies among themselves. Who changed the truth of God into a lie; and worshipped and served the creature rather than the Creator, who is blessed for ever. Amen.

Romans 16:17

Now I beseech you, brethren, to mark them who make dissensions and offences contrary to the doctrine which you have learned, and avoid them. 18 For they that are such, serve not Christ our Lord, but their own belly; and by pleasing speeches and good words, seduce the hearts of the innocent.

James 5: 19-20

My brethren, if any of you err from the truth, and one convert him: He must know that he who causeth a sinner to be converted from the error of his way, shall save his soul from death, and shall cover a multitude of sins.

What I do not understand is how one can be a Christian, whose faith depends upon their belief in the bible as the Word of God, and believe this philosophy that we can't tell others their beliefs are in error. SFIL had said that by believing others are wrong, we are putting limits on God. Rather, I think it is actually true of his philosophy, for he is saying that God would not have given His people the means to know Him, to follow Him, and be saved. Humans can be wrong because they are humans; imperfect, fallen beings that can make the wrong choices. I tried to tell SFIL that by his reasoning, there is no truth, but he just reverted to the putting limits on God and setting ourselves up as God retort. I don't think that answered the question.

I am sure it is unkind for me to say, but I am glad they live in Florida. It is very difficult to have them staying here all the time, constantly scrutinizing us as parents. Last night, Shaun put on the movie "Marley & Me". The in-laws had seen it, but we had not. It is rated PG, but we know that doesn't always mean it's exactly kid-friendly. In the movie, the main couple decides they want to have a baby. That's a sensitive subject to me where kids are concerned. So it comes to a part where they are on the bed, though fully-clothed, but none-the-less on top of each other and kissing.

At this point, I holler at Shaun to skip through it, stop it, whatever. Well, the in-laws thought this was ridiculous. SFIL said, "We've screened this movie." I'm sorry, but I KNOW their standards are not the same as mine for what is appropriate or "innocent". (There was also some foul language in the movie and another part where she called her husband and said she was naked. She wasn't, but still. The boys were in the shower for that part.) I said, "Well, I have had to field questions about how babies get in mommy's tummy several times already." "But they don't show anything." Yeah, except for the man and woman rolling around on the bed kissing in connection with making a baby, which as far as my kids know, and all they need to know at their ages, is that God puts them there. I didn't know how much they were going to show, and I am one who'd rather be safe than sorry and have some 'splaining to do later. MIL piped in and kept on about it, something about do we not want our children to see love and affection between two people, and Shaun told her, "WE'RE the parents." SFIL, to his credit, will drop things, but MIL will beat the dead horse to a bloody pulp. Seriously. So I finally said, "The discussion is OVER."

Then, last night we also discovered that Lauren and Kyle were both running a fever. So what did I do? I gave them some Tylenol. Yep, I did. While Shaun and I were out on the deck, I overheard MIL saying to SFIL, "I don't like what Shaun does with these kids. He pumps them so full of crap. Doesn't he know they say not to do that? Why can't they give them baby aspirin?" Blah blah blah. In the 10 years since I became a parent, and all the fevers I've dealt with, I have never had my pediatrician say that giving Tylenol for a fever isn't safe. In fact, many recommend to alternate the Tylenol and Ibuprofen for better fever control, usually every 2 hours. The danger is not giving children the appropriate dosage. Besides, how that qualified as "pumping them full of crap" I do not understand.

AHHHH!!!!!

Sorry, I digress. But I am ready for them to head back to the sunshine state. We teach our children that we believe there are false religions, monitor the movies they watch, and give them Tylenol for fevers or cough medicine for a cough. Somebody call DFS!

Last edited by nattyjk, Apr/29/2009, 1:29 pm


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