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Devout Catholic

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SSPX NEWS


Here is an interesting article from 2001

VATICAN, Mar. 23, 01 (CWNews.com) -- According to informed sources within the Vatican, discussions between the Holy See and the traditionalist Society of St. Pius X have reached a critical point, and a dramatic move to bring the Lefebvrist faction back into communion could come soon.

Vatican officials have refused to make any public comment on the latest discussions with the traditionalist group. Joaquin Navarro-Valls, the head of the Vatican press office, has confirmed that the discussions are ongoing, but refused to offer any further information about the content of those discussions or the schedule for further talks.

Nevertheless, sources suggest that a sort of "summit meeting" may take place in Rome-- perhaps as early as next week-- bringing together Vatican officials with the bishops ordained by the late Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre. The purpose of that meeting would be to end the schism that began when Archbishop Lefebvre went ahead with those episcopal ordinations despite the Vatican's opposition.

Pope John Paul II, it is generally understood, is very anxious to bring the division caused by that illicit ordination to an end as soon as possible. He has asked Cardinal Dario Castrillon Hoyos-- in his capacity as prefect of the Congregation for the Clergy and president of the Ecclesia Dei commission-- to make the efforts to reconcile the Society of St. Pius X a top priority. Last December 29, at a meeting with Cardinal Castrillon Hoyos, Bishop Bernard Fellay-- the superior of the Society of St. Pius X-- said that his group sought three concessions from the Vatican: a lifting of the ban of excommunication, a regularization of the status of the bishops ordained by Archbishop Lefebvre (and a fifth bishop ordained by them), and the establishment of the Society as an order of pontifical right. In February of this year, in a letter to the Pope (with copies to the heads of the Roman Curia) Bishop Fellay suggested a slightly different set of terms: the lifting of excommunications and the announcement that every Catholic priest has the right to celebrate the Mass according to the traditional rite. This latter condition would mean an end to the "indult" approach to the traditional Mass, which requires the approval of the diocesan bishop.

Cardinal Castrillon Hoyos replied to the traditionalist bishop's suggestions by saying that the first condition-- the lifting of the excommunication-- did not present any problems. However, the cardinal indicated that the Holy See was not prepared to accept the second point.

From the perspective of the Holy See, the difficulty with the Society of St. Pius X involves more than the use of the Tridentine-rite liturgy. The traditionalist movement has raised serious questions about whether the Novus Ordo Mass is valid, and has also questioned the authority of some Vatican II documents. The Society of St. Pius X has also generally opposed Vatican statements and actions in the fields of regarding ecumenism, inter- religious dialogue, and religious freedom. Thus the question of accepting the traditional Mass is bound up with larger questions about the traditionalists' acceptance of Church authority and Catholic teachings.

The next step in the discussions between the Society and the Holy See, according to Vatican insiders, might be a meeting in Rome. Bishop Fellay would lead the traditionalist contingent at that meeting, but would also be accompanied by three of the four other bishops ordained by Archbishop Lefebvre. (The fourth, Bishop Williamson, has indicated opposition to the latest efforts at reconciliation.) Another likely participant would be the Brazilian bishop, ordained by the other bishops of the Society, who now serves a "para-diocese" in Campos, Brazil, unrecognized by the Holy See.

Vatican officials, speaking anonymously, indicate that such a meeting could take place very soon: perhaps before Easter, and possibly as soon as next week. One source suggested that the meeting would begin on Tuesday, March 27.

If such a meeting does take place-- again, according to reports from Vatican insiders-- the Holy See might even propose a juridical solution to the status of the Society of St. Pius X. Several possible solutions have been mentioned in the rumor-mills of Rome.

One possibility would be the establishment of a new personal prelature for traditionalist Catholics. The personal prelature-- a recent canonical invention-- allows a good deal of latitude, and since only one personal prelature (Opus Dei) has been recognized, the "ground rules" of that structure are not firmly established. However, it seems unlikely that a personal prelature would give the traditionalists the autonomy they seek, since it would not allow for recognition of religious congregations or of the Brazilian traditionalist diocese.

Another approach would be the establishment of a new patriarchate. But while that possibility would suit the traditionalists' needs, the prospect would appear to be unlikely. The Holy See has been reluctant to establish a patriarchate for the Ukrainian Catholic Church despite years of entreaties from that Byzantine-rite community. It seems unrealistic to suspect that a schismatic group would receive a status which has been denied to Catholics who suffered through persecution and remained loyal to Rome.

Nevertheless, rumors about the possible creation of such a new structure continue to swirl around Rome. And those rumors may help to explain the renewed interest in the discussions between the Holy See and the Society of St. Pius X, as well as the new sense of urgency to bring those discussions to a conclusion.

The last several months of discussions were triggered by a Jubilee pilgrimage in August of last year, which brought 5,000 traditionalists to the basilica of St. Mary Major in Rome. During that visit, Bishop Fellay told the monthly magazine 30 Days that he would answer any invitation to speak with the Pope, out of "filial obedience to the head of the Church." In September, Cardinal Castrillon Hoyos told the same magazine that the Holy See was ready to entertain proposals from the traditionalist Society, and that any such proposals "would be examined with respect from the perspective of the authentic welfare of the entire ecclesial community."

http://www.omm.org/news/03-23-01-cwnews-rome-sspx.html

Last edited by SHJIHM, Feb/10/2006, 11:15 am


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Feb/10/2006, 11:14 am Link to this post Send Email to SHJIHM   Send PM to SHJIHM
 
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Re: SSPX NEWS


Feb 4th News

 Vatican, Feb. 04 (CWNews.com) - Pope Benedict XVI (bio - news) will meet with leaders of the Roman Curia on February 13. The top item on the agenda for discussion, according to an Italian media report, will be the Vatican efforts to achieve a reconciliation with the traditionalist Society of St. Pius X (SSPX).

During the first meetings of the conclave at which Pope Benedict was elected, several prelates suggested that it would be useful for the Pope to hold occasional "cabinet meetings" with top Vatican officials. The February 13 meeting will be the first such general consultation. The Vatican has not announced plans for the meeting, nor given any indication of the topics that could be discussed. The Pontiff could be seeking opinions on a wide variety of subjects.

However, the Italian daily Il Giornale reports that the main topic will be the SSPX: the traditionalist group that broke with Rome in 1988 after its founder, the late Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre, ordained three new bishops in defiance of Rome's orders. The Vatican responded to those illicit episcopal ordinations by excommunicating Archbishop Lefebvre and the three bishops he ordained. Now, according to Il Giornale, the Pope wants to discuss the possibility of rescinding those excommunications. That move could eliminate a source of tensions in the continuing talks between the Vatican and the SSPX, aimed to restoring the traditionalst group to full unity with the Holy See.

Pope Benedict will also discuss his own inclination to allow broader use of the pre-conciliar Roman Missal, Il Giornale reports. The SSPX clings exclusively to the old, or Tridentine, rite. Since 1984, the traditional Mass has been allowed in Catholic dioceses only with the permission of the local bishop. Pope Benedict might eliminate the need for priests to obtain that permission, according to Il Giornale. The Italian newspaper said that it had obtained its information from Church officials directly involved in the talks between the Vatican and the SSPX leadership.

Cardinal Dario Castrillon Hoyos (bio - news), who is president of the Ecclesia Dei commission established by Pope John Paul II (bio - news) to coordinate the Vatican's pastoral outreach to Catholic traditionalists, has declined to comment recently on talks with the SSPX. However, an informed Vatican source has confirmed, in talks with the I Media news agency, that the Vatican will soon hold an important meeting to discuss a plan "the eventual reconciliation of the Church with the SSPX." That disclosure seems to match the Il Giornale report regarding the February 13 meeting.

Bishop Bernard Fellay, the superior general of the SSPX, has recently given indications that substantial progress has been made in the latest negotiations with Rome. "The discussions have been lengthy, but there have probably been the most fruitful that we have had to date," he told reporters at a press conference in Paris on January 13. The SSPX leader said that the talks were aimed toward the "regularization" of the status of the traditionalist group.

At that press conference, Bishop Fellay said that traditionalists were particularly delighted by Pope Benedict's address to the Roman Curia last December 22, in which the Pontiff discussed the proper interpretation of Vatican II. "One can readily see that the Holy Father is trying to put the Council in a new light," the SSPX leader observed. Traditionalist leaders have frequently complained that the teachings of Vatican II are a radical departure from prior Catholic traditions; in his December 22 the Pope inveighed against the notion that the Council created a "discontinuity and rupture" in Church teaching, arguing instead for "a hermeneutic of reform, renewal, and continuity" with Catholic tradition. That papal address, and several subsequent statements by Curial officials, seemed to be worded deliberately to encourage traditionalist Catholics. At the same time, Bishop Fellay and other SSPX leaders have issued statements respectful of the Vatican, avoiding the direct criticism that has often marked the group's statements in the past. The careful framing of public statements by both Vatican officials and SSPX leaders has encouraged observers to believe that negotiations toward a reconciliation are advancing rapidly.

At the Vatican, informed officials now speak of rapprochement with the traditionalist group-- in terms that suggest a gradual movement toward reconciliation, but not a final resolution. "It is too early" to speak about a "decisive" reconciliation, one official maintained.

While reporting that Cardinal Castrillon Hoyos and Bishop Fellay exchanged "positive" message in January, a Vatican source adds that there remains "too much opposition" within the SSPX to expect a full reconciliation in the immediate future. Both Vatican officials and SSPX stalwarts have also expressed concerns that their counterparts are using deliberately vague language, to avoid the firm commitments that the other side wants.

The February 2 Il Giornale report says that Cardinal Julian Herranz has predicted the eventual creation of a new apostolic administration for traditionalists. (Cardinal Herranz, as the president of the Pontifical Council for Legislative Texts, is the top Vatican official on issues involving the interpretation of canon law.) In an agreement announced in January 2002, the Vatican created an apostolic administration in Campos, Brazil for another traditionalist group, recognizing the leader of that group as a bishop.

Questioned about that possibility in January, Bishop Fellay replied: "I am almost sure that it [an apostolic administration] will be granted to us." But Bishop Fellay added that the creation of an apostolic administration would not resolve all of the desires of the SSPX. "We do not want to be Catholics who separated apart," he said, explaining: "We are not asking for the old Mass just for ourselves, but for everyone." Last August 29, Pope Benedict received Bishop Fellay in a private audience at the papal summer residence in Castel Gandolfo. Afterward, informed officials said that the talks were cordial and productive, and the Vatican press office suggested that a resolution would be achieved "within a reasonable time," with the two sides "proceeding step by step" toward reconciliation. Bishop Fellay sounded an even more positive note. "Rome wants to go quickly," hs aid. "But we are not so sure."

The SSPX leader explained his reluctance to accept a quick reconciliation. "If we sign today," he disclosed, "not all of our faithful would follow us." A hard-line faction within the SSPX, led by Bishop Richard Williamson, has indicated that it is likely to oppose any reconciliation with the Holy See.

Based in Switzerland, the SSPX had 441 priests at the end of 2004. The traditionalist society is now active in 59 countries, and runs 6 seminaries. The SSPX is particularly strong in France. About one-third of the society's priests serve there, and the traditionalist group estimates that 100,000 French Catholics attend Mass at SSPX chapels.

Pope Benedict, who was involved in unsuccessful last-minute talks with Archbishop Lefebvre in 1988, aimed at averting a split, has always hoped for a restoration of full unity with the traditionalist group. In 1985, three years before the final break, then-Cardinal Ratzinger said: "We must all work for reconciliation, as much as possible, and use every opportunity for that purpose."

At the same time, Cardinal Ratzinger, then working in his role as prefect of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, warned traditionalist leaders that they must accept the teachings of the Church. He said that there is "no future of a position of fundamental rejection in respect to Vatican II."

The ideological rejection of Vatican II is illogical in itself, Cardinal Ratzinger remarked, since traditionalists who profess to uphold the inerrant authority of the magisterium cannot reject the magisterial teaching of the Council and the post-conciliar Pontiffs. "Why the popes up to Pius XII, and not afterward?" he asked. In the 1980s, Cardinal Ratzinger told Archbishop Lefebvre that he could not make his fidelity to the Holy See contingent, applying his obedience only to the teachings that he found congenial. Now, as Pope Benedict XVI, he hopes to make the same point to Archbishop Lefebvre's followers.

Last edited by SHJIHM, Feb/10/2006, 11:17 am


---
"My Sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow Me.


Feb/10/2006, 11:16 am Link to this post Send Email to SHJIHM   Send PM to SHJIHM
 
Michael D Profile
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Re: SSPX NEWS


Here is some of what I wanted to post earlier.

Jan. 31: Tomorrow, as previously reported here, representatives of all the religious groups which form the aggregate Lefevbrist movement are meeting in Flavigny, France.

It is widely believed that the convocation is being held in an attempt to unite the groups and brief them on a proposed reconciliation between the Holy See and the Society of St. Pius X, the flagship splinter-sect which broke communion with Rome in 1988 at the ordination of four bishops without papal approval by the Tridentine renegade Archbishop Marcel Lefebvre.

In exchange for the return to full communion of the Lefebvrist bishops -- which by no means could come immediately, but toward which goal tomorrow's summit is oriented -- and other, unspecified conditions, it's said the Holy See could be prepared to grant:
* an acknowledgment that the Pian, or Tridentine, rite was not abrogated in the liturgical reforms following the Second Vatican Council;
* an acknowledgment of the Old Mass' place and value in the life of the Latin church;
* an acknowledgment that the SSPX never sought on its own accord to enter into schism;
* an Apostolic Administration, subject to the Congregation for the Clergy, for the Society to maintain administration of its chapels, seminaries and other apostolates

Before anything is sealed, however, several questions do remain.

The first is whether, if the plan as sketched out goes forward at all, the four SSPX bishops return in unison. Two of them are said to be publicly noncommittal: Bernard Tissier de Mallerais, and Richard Williamson, who last night was reported to be "obstinate." Alfonso de Galarreta is said to be more aligned with Fellay's pro-reconciliation stance.

The timetable for all this has been expedited by the exigencies of the SSPX leadership. Fellay's term as Superior General expires later this year, and as he is perceived as the most-amenable of the four to a reconciliation, an accord hammered out with him as a principal would likely provide the best possible outcome, both for Rome and Econe.

While promotions and sacramental titles would not be part of any deal, as Popes do not bargain their prerogatives and the freedom of the office, Schmidberger -- the last of Lefebvre's closest aides still in the Society's upper echelon of leadership -- is seen as the Society's likely future head, particularly given the moderation with which he has handled the issue of its potential return; he was in the room with Fellay on 29 August as the SSPX leadership met with a Pope for the first time since the 1988 excommunications.

Lastly, one would be led to wonder what Rome seeks in return for the concessions it seems prepared to grant the Society. In a word, as one source puts it, all Rome wants is "the four bishops back," and in communion. (Of course, in order to do so, they must profess to accept the validity of the teachings of the Second Vatican Council as part of the Magisterium, etc.)

Even if a splinter, or more than just a few, of the SSPX's priests and faithful remain outside the church, the Society's sources of sacramental life vis a vis the ordination of priests and the consecration of churches would be cut at the knees were the four bishops to return to Rome in one piece. Be reminded, however, that many variables remain fluid and are changing by the hour.

http://whispersintheloggia.blogspot.com/2006_01_01_whispersintheloggia_archive.html

My comments: Expectations are right now that if some of the bishops agree to conditions, Williamson will not be among them and may lead the followers who chose not to come back. I wonder how many that will be?


Last edited by Michael D, Feb/12/2006, 7:32 pm


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Feb/12/2006, 7:26 pm Link to this post Send Email to Michael D   Send PM to Michael D
 
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Re: SSPX NEWS


If this is true, reconciliation is probably still a long ways off. From the Whispers in the Loggia site...

SSPX: What Rome Gets
Andrea Tornielli runs his summary of yesterday's meeting in today's Il Giornale, reporting that the summit ran "several hours."

The summit of the dicastery heads "did not solve the argument," Tornielli writes, saying that a second meeting of its kind -- scheduled for 23 March -- "represents a novelty in the Vatican and indicates that the Pope intents to listen to and value the work of his collaborators in the Curia, just as he did when he led the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith," while at the same time not letting slip one bit of his own desision-making authority.

Tornielli relates that two notable interventions were made.

According to the report, the first came from Cardinal Francis Arinze, prefect of the Congregation for Divine Worship and the Discipline of the Sacraments who, according to Il Giornale, said something along these lines: that "freeing the Old Mass" in the hoped-for universally mandated wide sense (i.e. Roman legislation which gives no degree of discretion to the bishops in their local churches) "is not possible," while it remains necessary that some sort of "instrument" can be found in light of the request of the faithful disposed to the Pian Rite. The advocated solution was said to be "a new indult... which explicitly repeats to the bishops the appeal voiced long ago by John Paul II, who told them to be 'generous' towards the Traditionalists." And, as part of the conditions, priests who celebrate the Old Mass would be obliged to, "at the very least," participate in the concelebration of the (Novus Ordo) Holy Thursday Chrism Mass with their bishop.

The other side was, predictably, taken by Cardinal Dario Castrillion Hoyos, the prefect of the Congregation for the Clergy and president of Ecclesia Dei (which handles the implementation of the indult) who has been the Holy See's point man on discussions with the SSPX. According to Tornielli, Castrillion took the line that Bernard Fellay did in his August audience with Benedict XVI -- that the Holy See "cancel" the excommunications "as Paul VI did when meeting with the Orthodox," at which point the mutual excommunications of 1054 were simultaneously expunged.

Lastly, after several weeks of reports -- broken here -- of what the Society would receive in exchange for its return to communion with the Catholic church: the nullification of the excommunications, autonomous juridical status, etc., Tornielli runs for the first time what Rome would demand from the Society in exchange, according to Castrillion's line of argument.

In sum, it would involve three consents and acknowledgments from the Society's leadership:

1. The acceptance of the Second Vatican Council (seemingly as a valid ecumenical council whose decrees carry weight in terms of Tradition, as opposed to a simply pastoral one which lacked force).
2. Obedience to the Pope
3. The validity of the postconciliar liturgy

And there you have it.... More as it comes in.

---
Nothing by force, but everything by charity.

Ss. Thomas Aquinas and Augustine, pray for us.
Feb/14/2006, 12:42 pm Link to this post Send Email to Michael D   Send PM to Michael D
 
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Re: SSPX NEWS


Vatican, Feb. 15 (CWNews.com) - At a Monday meeting of the Roman Curia, Cardinal Dario Castrillon Hoyos (bio - news) presented a plan to regularize the status of the traditionalist Society of St. Pius X, according to informed sources.


The Vatican has issued no formal statement about the meeting, beyond disclosing that Pope Benedict XVI (bio - news) had summoned the leaders of the Roman Curia for a morning meeting on February 13. None of the participants at the meeting have spoken for the record about the proceedings.

http://www.catholicworldnews.com/news/viewstory.cfm?recnum=42437


---
Nothing by force, but everything by charity.

Ss. Thomas Aquinas and Augustine, pray for us.
Feb/15/2006, 6:55 pm Link to this post Send Email to Michael D   Send PM to Michael D
 
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Re: SSPX NEWS


quote:

Michael D wrote:

Vatican, Feb. 15 (CWNews.com) - At a Monday meeting of the Roman Curia, Cardinal Dario Castrillon Hoyos (bio - news) presented a plan to regularize the status of the traditionalist Society of St. Pius X, according to informed sources.


The Vatican has issued no formal statement about the meeting, beyond disclosing that Pope Benedict XVI (bio - news) had summoned the leaders of the Roman Curia for a morning meeting on February 13. None of the participants at the meeting have spoken for the record about the proceedings.



http://www.catholicworldnews.com/news/viewstory.cfm?recnum=42437




I wonder what this means?



Last edited by SHJIHM, Feb/16/2006, 2:27 pm


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Feb/16/2006, 12:18 pm Link to this post Send Email to SHJIHM   Send PM to SHJIHM
 
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Re: SSPX NEWS


quote:

I wonder what this means?


I don't know, Tony. I suspect we will not hear anything more until March 23 which is when the next conference with the SSPX is scheduled. Like you, I want to see this concluded with unity as the ultimate aim. I also was hoping for the indult. I don't see it as a threat to anything because I do not believe the NO is going anywhere anytime soon. It will be the normative mass for at least another generation without its suppression which is not even being considered. Perhaps there is a real desire to end this but if hearts are hardening on either side, our hopes will probably not be realized yet.

---
Nothing by force, but everything by charity.

Ss. Thomas Aquinas and Augustine, pray for us.
Feb/16/2006, 7:20 pm Link to this post Send Email to Michael D   Send PM to Michael D
 
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Re: SSPX NEWS


Is it a coincidence that the next scheduled meeting with the SSPX is one day before the upcoming Consistory of Cadinals?

---
Nothing by force, but everything by charity.

Ss. Thomas Aquinas and Augustine, pray for us.
Feb/22/2006, 5:58 pm Link to this post Send Email to Michael D   Send PM to Michael D
 
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Re: SSPX NEWS


Perhaps not. Perhaps Benedict plans on bringing a proclamation to the conclave?

---
"My Sheep hear my voice, and I know them, and they follow Me.


Feb/22/2006, 10:23 pm Link to this post Send Email to SHJIHM   Send PM to SHJIHM
 
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Re: SSPX NEWS


Perhaps. Maybe he is hoping to at least present his plan for reconciliation to the Cardinals in the hope of gaining their support.

I am still hoping for a universal indult and it would be a good place to announce it.

Last edited by Michael D, Feb/24/2006, 8:48 am


---
Nothing by force, but everything by charity.

Ss. Thomas Aquinas and Augustine, pray for us.
Feb/24/2006, 8:47 am Link to this post Send Email to Michael D   Send PM to Michael D
 


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